COVID-19: Control-distribution or An Out Of Hand Experiment?

C McC Mc Posts: 3,541
edited March 15 in News & Current Events

The COVID-19 pandemic requires another look? What should one make of this thing the "infecting" thousands and "affecting" millions? Is this a man-made pandemic cooked-up in a lab in Wuinen, China and gotten out of hand? Was certain animals, the Bible deems "unclean" (Deut. 11; Lev 14), were used and got into the human food-chain by accident or by design? Where are the dead from this virus? Were they buried or cremated? Have you seen family members of those who died? Is this a hoax of hysteria or the works of an evil person bent on revenge?

For starters, what is the true characteristics of those "infected" by the Coronavirus? See below a comparison of COVID-19 to other common conditions: "Common Cold", "Flu", and "Allergies". The symptoms of each are compared. Who's testing whom? What who owns the test-kit that is used? Are there independent test kits and numbers of cases or death?

You may ask, why CM appears to have a change of heart about COVID-19? Brethren, step back and take a closer look with me at the answers to the following questions:

  1. Where did the Coronavirus started was it really China?
  2. Were there any U. S. Scientists working or conducting animal, genetics or disease experiments in China?
  3. Is this a sick-tactic by A PET member or the Plant-based Food Industry to force the world to become vegan or vegetarians?
  4. What happened to the man who first reported it? Did he died from COVID-19 or was he murdered?
  5. COVID-19 was long known in animals? Is not a vaccine exists to treat animals with the Coronavirus?
  6. What race of people infected the most with the Coronavirus?
  7. What race of people are least infected by the Coronavirus?
  8. Is the Coronavirus a genetic experiment? If proven, did it got out of hand?
  9. What countries have the greatest number of "reported" cases or death?
  10. What countries, in proximity of each other, are infected the most with the Coronavirus?
  11. What people, labs, or locations doing the testing for the Coronavirus?
  12. How is the Coronavirus transmitted? Is it airborne, opened wound, body fluids, or through the skin, or like anthrax?
    1. If it's the latter, is there a pattern emerging of pigmentations ratio to people infected?
  13. Are there cases of Children infected or dead from the Coronavirus? If so, how many and where?
  14. Are schools closed around the world because adults or for the children (students)?
  15. Is the Coronavirus a pandemic of greed and hysteria?
  16. Are people justified to be concern about a virus that may be in the human food-chain?
  17. Is this the work of bio-medical geneticist revenge upon wealthy people and nations?
  18. In view of the ten (10) WORST PANDEMICS IN HISTORY, what are the common dominator countries?:
  • HIV/AIDS PANDEMIC (AT ITS PEAK, 2005-2012). Death Toll: 36 million Cause: HIV/AIDS
  • FLU PANDEMIC (1968) -- Death Toll: 1 million -- Cause: Influenza
  • ASIAN FLU (1956-1958) -- Death Toll: 2 million Cause: Influenza
  • FLU PANDEMIC (1918) -- Death Toll: 20 -50 million Cause: Influenza
  • SIXTH CHOLERA PANDEMIC (1910-1911)-- Death Toll: 800,000+ Cause: Cholera
  • FLU PANDEMIC (1889-1890) -- Death Toll: 1 million Cause: Influenza
  • THIRD CHOLERA PANDEMIC (1852–1860) -- Death Toll: 1 million Death Toll: Cause: Cholera
  • THE BLACK DEATH (1346-1353) -- Death Toll: 75 – 200 million -- Cause: Bubonic Plague
  • PLAGUE OF JUSTINIAN (541-542) -- Death Toll: 25 million Cause: Bubonic Plague
  • ANTONINE PLAGUE (165 AD) -- Death Toll: 5 million -- Cause: Unknown

These PANDEMICs and the one today, are man-made? Are they plagues on the land and judgment from God?

When you supply answers to each of these questions what pattern or thread do you see manifesting themselves without any manipulation? If it appears that I have more questions than answers, this is by design and an instrument you to see what I have seen or not. Don't be afraid of truth or to think anew? He who wants answers, must ask question. CM


SOURCES:

http://news.discovery.com/human/health/10-worst-epidemics-130917.htm

http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/cholera-s-seven-pandemics-1.758504

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3867475/

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/completelist/0,29569,2027479,00.html

http://www.infoplease.com/cig/dangerous-diseases-epidemics/bubonic-plague.html

http://www.who.int/csr/resources/publications/surveillance/plague.pdf

http://healthvermont.gov/prevent/Plague.aspx

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/black_death_of_1348_to_1350.htm

http://www.loyno.edu/~history/journal/1996-7/Smith.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/01/health/01plague.html?_r=0

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4381924.stm

http://www.loyno.edu/~history/journal/1996-7/Smith.html

http://www.infoplease.com/cig/dangerous-diseases-epidemics/smallpox-12000-years-terror.html

http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs360/en/index.html

http://www.avert.org/worldstats.htm

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/statistics/basics/

http://www.history.com/topics/1918-flu-pandemic

http://www.infoplease.com/cig/dangerous-diseases-epidemics/smallpox-12000-years-terror.html

http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/89/7/11-088815/en/

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Comments

  • reformedreformed Posts: 2,777

    Why are you comparing it to the flu or common cold? Why not compare it to other coronaviruses such as SARS or MERS?

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541
    edited March 16

    Something is going on.

    US tries to lure German firm working on virus vaccine: Report

    Berlin is trying to stop Washington from persuading a German company seeking a coronavirus vaccine to move its research to the United States, prompting German politicians to insist no country should have a monopoly on any future vaccine.


    German government sources told Reuters News Agency on Sunday that the US administration was looking into how it could gain access to a potential vaccine being developed by a German firm, CureVac.

    Earlier, the Welt am Sonntag German newspaper reported that President Donald Trump had offered funds to lure CureVac to the US, and the German government was making counteroffers to tempt it to stay.


    Responding to the report, a US official said: "This story is wildly overplayed. The US government has spoken with many [more than 25] companies that claim they can help with a vaccine. Most of these companies already received seed funding from US investors."

    Ulrich Brueckner, a political analyst in Germany, talks to Al Jazeera.


    What is this nonsense? Is Germany consider getting in bed with America and Trump? CM

    PS. "Shame on USA president"!

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    German government sources told Reuters News Agency on Sunday that the US administration was looking into how it could gain access to a potential vaccine being developed by a German firm, CureVac.

    Earlier, the Welt am Sonntag German newspaper reported that President Donald Trump had offered funds to lure CureVac to the US, and the German government was making counteroffers to tempt it to stay.

    The man holding vast majority of the CureVac companiy, Mr. Hopp, today issued a statement that there had been "offers" from USA side to "transfer the company into USA hands" (my simple word summary) which he rejected ....

    But then, in muddied waters, only few know what is going on as they are following the course set before all the mud was put into the waters in order to disguise their evil deed.

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    Wolfgang,

    You don't see the potential profiteering in the making? Who will try to make money on the woes of a world disaster? Your Chancellor is better than what being suggested. CM

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    You don't see the potential profiteering in the making? Who will try to make money on the woes of a world disaster?

    There are some who may have planned disaster from a while back in order to keep their greed satisfied ... as a USA president once said, "Nothing in politics just happens ... it's all planned"

    Your Chancellor is better than what being suggested. CM

    That lady has been and is a disaster for the German people ... incompetent, or perhaps -- considering the saying of that USA president -- just carrying out orders ...

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    Brethren,

    This coronavirus appears to be more and more something cooked-up in a lab and/or genetically targeted. Review the questions above. Do you see what I see? Stay tuned. Next post, some hard science. Be safe, be blessed and be informed! CM

  • reformedreformed Posts: 2,777

    No it doesn't. There is no proof of that at all. You are starting to sound like Wolfgang. You got a new tin foil hat recently? Idiot.

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    Hi there,

    yesterday, there was some news in WhatsApp about Iboprofen, that the use of it would possibly worsen conditions with Corona infections. The university of Vienna, Austria, and others declared this warning about Iboprofen to be "fake news".

    Now, get this, today (!) the WHO and the Swiss health service are officially warning to not use this medication because it may worsen the condition of an infected person ....

    Seems like the official health experts and virus scientists are beginning to be so involved or mixed up in what "the official story" is that they are beginning to catch each other in lies and stories ....

    This Corona virus has not yet been proven to actually exist as a biological, medically dangerous beyond other influenza type viruses in the past, but it certainly is a "political virus" that is used by obviously global players who are up for something evil. When the population is openly told in TV news conference by the chancellor, president, that they should or must stay at home because that is the government's best means for the people's protection, you know that this has nothing whatever to do anymore with a virus wave making the rounds. But then, many folks are so "government patriotic" that they would perhaps allow themselves to be imprisoned "for their own safety" and applaud the government for doing so. 😪 😥

  • Bill_ColeyBill_Coley Posts: 1,949

    @Wolfgang posted:

    yesterday, there was some news in WhatsApp about Iboprofen, that the use of it would possibly worsen conditions with Corona infections. The university of Vienna, Austria, and others declared this warning about Iboprofen to be "fake news".

    Now, get this, today (!) the WHO and the Swiss health service are officially warning to not use this medication because it may worsen the condition of an infected person ....

    Seems like the official health experts and virus scientists are beginning to be so involved or mixed up in what "the official story" is that they are beginning to catch each other in lies and stories ....

    It's a well-known aphorism of politics in the U.S. that has particular relevance in chaotic times such as these, Wolfgang: You have a right to your own opinions, but you don't have a right to your own facts. Your summary badly misrepresents the facts in the matter to which it refers.

    What the Medical University of Vienna in Austria called "fake news" were rumors/"reports" in WhatsApp text and voice messages that research AT THAT UNIVERSITY had linked Ibuprofen usage to high Covid-19 virus multiplication rates. Specifically, the university's statement said, "Attention! Currently circulating WhatsApp text and voice messages about alleged research results of the "Wiener Uniklinik" about a connection between Ibuprofen and Covid19 are Fake News, which have nothing to do with MedUniWien."

    The University MADE NO COMMENT as to the medical or scientific virtues of the Ibuprofen claim. It simply said, in effect, "Don't believe everything you're reading or hearing about our university's research into Covid-19. When we have something to say about the virus, we won't publish it in WhatsApp." In addition, most Internet savvy consumers of information know WhatsApp is NOT a trusted name in medical research. 😝

    A three minute Google search provided sufficient information for me to conclude there ARE widely-accepted reasons to consider not treating Covid-19 symptoms with Ibuprofen (e.g. its effects on kidney function might affect a patient's health in other ways). But the Vienna school's statement DID NOT ADDRESS the merits of the pain medication in this particular circumstance.

    As I indicated: You're welcome to your own opinions, Wolfgang, but not your own facts.


    This Corona virus has not yet been proven to actually exist as a biological, medically dangerous beyond other influenza type viruses in the past, but it certainly is a "political virus" that is used by obviously global players who are up for something evil. When the population is openly told in TV news conference by the chancellor, president, that they should or must stay at home because that is the government's best means for the people's protection, you know that this has nothing whatever to do anymore with a virus wave making the rounds. But then, many folks are so "government patriotic" that they would perhaps allow themselves to be imprisoned "for their own safety" and applaud the government for doing so. 😪 😥

    Your assertion about the seriousness of the virus is false. Your political screed is rooted in conspiracy theories. Your point of view, therefore and for the sake of health of millions/billions of people world-wide, will not guide public health policies in most nations.

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    Your point of view, therefore and for the sake of health of millions/billions of people world-wide, will not guide public health policies in most nations.

    I suppose, we will eventually see ..... thus far there has not been any death over here actually due to this virus, rather the deaths have been due to previous conditions / other diseases which caused the death of the person. Some reports finally come out and admit that the normally healthy infected experience very mild cases of influenza type symptoms, sometimes hardly noticeable. How does that fit with the hype that this is "a deadly virus" and people getting the impression that they might drop dead once a test shows a positive result?

    Also, too many "conspiracy theories" have actually turned out to have been indeed theories developed by and put into operation by actual conspiracies. Europe appears to be at war at this time .... the measures taken and orders issued by political leaders are exactly what is meant to be war time policies. Some of course - even though they experience the effects in their own life - will claim that this is not the case and such idea that it might be is a conspiracy .... Welcome to the world of smoke and mirrors.

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    If this is not fake news, see aging the questions above. This is a beginning tracing and warning people.

    • 5809 -- Cases of U. S. Coronavirus
    • 35 -- State of emergencies
    • 100-- deaths (where are these deaths?)

    Read the entire article. Especially the bold print. CM

    "People with Type A blood are MORE likely to catch coronavirus"


    What is the coronavirus? 

    A coronavirus is a type of virus which can cause illness in animals and people. Viruses break into cells inside their host and use them to reproduce itself and disrupt the body's normal functions. Coronaviruses are named after the Latin word 'corona', which means crown, because they are encased by a spiked shell which resembles a royal crown.

    The coronavirus from Wuhan is one which has never been seen before this outbreak. It has been named SARS-CoV-2 by the International Committee on Taxonomy of Viruses. The name stands for Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome coronavirus 2.

    Experts say the bug, which has killed around one in 50 patients since the outbreak began in December, is a 'sister' of the SARS illness which hit China in 2002, so has been named after it.

    The disease that the virus causes has been named COVID-19, which stands for coronavirus disease 2019.

    Dr Helena Maier, from the Pirbright Institute, said: 'Coronaviruses are a family of viruses that infect a wide range of different species including humans, cattle, pigs, chickens, dogs, cats and wild animals

    'Until this new coronavirus was identified, there were only six different coronaviruses known to infect humans.

    • Four of these cause a mild common cold-type illness, but since 2002 there has been the emergence of two new coronaviruses that can infect humans and result in more severe disease (Severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) and Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS) coronaviruses). 

    'Coronaviruses are known to be able to occasionally jump from one species to another and that is what happened in the case of SARS, MERS and the new coronavirus. The animal origin of the new coronavirus is not yet known.' 

    The first human cases were publicly reported from the Chinese city of Wuhan, where approximately 11million people live, after medics first started publicly reporting infections on December 31.

    By January 8, 59 suspected cases had been reported and seven people were in critical condition. Tests were developed for the new virus and recorded cases started to surge.

    The first person died that week and, by January 16, two were dead and 41 cases were confirmed. The next day, scientists predicted that 1,700 people had become infected, possibly up to 7,000. 


    Where does the virus come from?

    According to scientists, the virus almost certainly came from bats. Coronaviruses in general tend to originate in animals – the similar SARS and MERS viruses are believed to have originated in civet cats and camels, respectively.

    The first cases of COVID-19 came from people visiting or working in a live animal market in Wuhan, which has since been closed down for investigation.

    Although the market is officially a seafood market, other dead and living animals were being sold there, including wolf cubs, salamanders, snakes, peacocks, porcupines and camel meat. 

    A study by the Wuhan Institute of Virology, published in February 2020 in the scientific journal Nature,

    "found that the genetic make-up virus samples found in patients in China is 96 per cent identical to a coronavirus they found in bats".

    However, there were not many bats at the market so scientists say it was likely there was an animal which acted as a middle-man, contracting it from a bat before then transmitting it to a human. It has not yet been confirmed what type of animal this was.

    Dr Michael Skinner, a virologist at Imperial College London, was not involved with the research but said: 'The discovery definitely places the origin of nCoV in bats in China.

    'We still do not know whether another species served as an intermediate host to amplify the virus, and possibly even to bring it to the market, nor what species that host might have been.'  

    So far the fatalities are quite low. Why are health experts so worried about it? 

    Experts say the international community is concerned about the virus because so little is known about it and it appears to be spreading quickly.

    It is similar to SARS, which infected 8,000 people and killed nearly 800 in an outbreak in Asia in 2003, in that it is a type of coronavirus which infects humans' lungs. It is less deadly than SARS, however, which killed around one in 10 people, compared to approximately one in 50 for COVID-19.

    Another reason for concern is that nobody has any immunity to the virus because they've never encountered it before. This means it may be able to cause more damage than viruses we come across often, like the flu or common cold.

    Speaking at a briefing in January, Oxford University professor, Dr Peter Horby, said: 'Novel viruses can spread much faster through the population than viruses which circulate all the time because we have no immunity to them.

    'Most seasonal flu viruses have a case fatality rate of less than one in 1,000 people. Here we're talking about a virus where we don't understand fully the severity spectrum but it's possible the case fatality rate could be as high as two per cent.'

    If the death rate is truly two per cent, that means two out of every 100 patients who get it will die. 

    'My feeling is it's lower,' Dr Horby added. 'We're probably missing this iceberg of milder cases. But that's the current circumstance we're in.

    'Two per cent case fatality rate is comparable to the Spanish Flu pandemic in 1918 so it is a significant concern globally.'

    How does the virus spread?

    • The illness can spread between people just through coughs and sneezes, making it an extremely contagious infection. And it may also spread even before someone has symptoms.
    • It is believed to travel in the saliva and even through water in the eyes, therefore close contact, kissing, and sharing cutlery or utensils are all risky.
    • It can also live on surfaces, such as plastic and steel, for up to 72 hours, meaning people can catch it by touching contaminated surfaces.

    Originally, people were thought to be catching it from a live animal market in Wuhan city. But cases soon began to emerge in people who had never been there, which forced medics to realise it was spreading from person to person

    Once someone has caught the COVID-19 virus it may take between two and 14 days, or even longer, for them to show any symptoms – but they may still be contagious during this time.

    What does the virus do to you? What are the symptoms?

    • Once someone has caught the COVID-19 virus it may take between two and 14 days, or even longer, for them to show any symptoms – but they may still be contagious during this time.
    • If and when they do become ill, typical signs include a runny nose, a cough, sore throat and a fever (high temperature).
    • The vast majority of patients will recover from these without any issues, and many will need no medical help at all.
    • In a small group of patients, who seem mainly to be the elderly or those with long-term illnesses, it can lead to pneumonia. Pneumonia is What does the virus do to you? What are the symptoms?an infection in which the insides of the lungs swell up and fill with fluid. It makes it increasingly difficult to breathe and, if left untreated, can be fatal and suffocate people.
    • Figures are showing that young children do not seem to be particularly badly affected by the virus, which they say is peculiar considering their susceptibility to flu, but it is not clear why. 

    What have genetic tests revealed about the virus? 

    • Scientists in China have recorded the genetic sequences of around 19 strains of the virus and released them to experts working around the world. 
    • This allows others to study them, develop tests and potentially look into treating the illness they cause.   
    • Examinations have revealed the coronavirus did not change much – changing is known as mutating – much during the early stages of its spread.
    • However, the director-general of China's Center for Disease Control and Prevention, Gao Fu, said the virus was mutating and adapting as it spread through people.
    • This means efforts to study the virus and to potentially control it may be made extra difficult because the virus might look different every time scientists analyse it.   
    • More study may be able to reveal whether the virus first infected a small number of people then change and spread from them, or whether there were various versions of the virus coming from animals which have developed separately.

    How dangerous is the virus?  

    The virus has a death rate of around two per cent. This is a similar death rate to the Spanish Flu outbreak which, in 1918, went on to kill around 50million people.

    Experts have been conflicted since the beginning of the outbreak about whether the true number of people who are infected is significantly higher than the official numbers of recorded cases. Some people are expected to have such mild symptoms that they never even realise they are ill unless they're tested, so only the more serious cases get discovered, making the death toll seem higher than it really is.

    However, an investigation into government surveillance in China said it had found no reason to believe this was true.

    Dr Bruce Aylward, a World Health Organization official who went on a mission to China, said there was no evidence that figures were only showing the tip of the iceberg, and said recording appeared to be accurate, Stat News reported.


    Can the virus be cured? 

    The COVID-19 virus cannot be cured and it is proving difficult to contain.

    Antibiotics do not work against viruses, so they are out of the question. Antiviral drugs can work, but the process of understanding a virus then developing and producing drugs to treat it would take years and huge amounts of money.

    No vaccine exists for the coronavirus yet and it's not likely one will be developed in time to be of any use in this outbreak, for similar reasons to the above.

    The National Institutes of Health in the US, and Baylor University in Waco, Texas, say they are working on a vaccine based on what they know about coronaviruses in general, using information from the SARS outbreak. But this may take a year or more to develop, according to Pharmaceutical Technology.

    Currently, governments and health authorities are working to contain the virus and to care for patients who are sick and stop them infecting other people.

    People who catch the illness are being quarantined in hospitals, where their symptoms can be treated and they will be away from the uninfected public.

    And airports around the world are putting in place screening measures such as having doctors on-site, taking people's temperatures to check for fevers and using thermal screening to spot those who might be ill (infection causes a raised temperature).

    However, it can take weeks for symptoms to appear, so there is only a small likelihood that patients will be spotted up in an airport.

    Is this outbreak an epidemic or a pandemic?   

    • The outbreak was declared a pandemic on March 11.
    • A pandemic is defined by the World Health Organization as the 'worldwide spread of a new disease'. 

    Previously, the UN agency said most cases outside of Hubei had been 'spillover' from the epicentre, so the disease wasn't actually spreading actively around the world.

    Certain people are more vulnerable than others. Be informed. CM


    SOURCE:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-8122493/People-Type-blood-likely-catch-coronavirus.html

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    "Worthwhile conversation is a garden that requires careful tending and attention, and sometimes weeding".

    Let the truth be known. -- CM

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    Brethren,

    The Coronavirus has spread too far, to too many, too fast, and affected too many countries and markets, churches, worships, religions, and people's "peace of mind". Is this real? How do we explain this? Is this a plague upon the land by God? Is it worldwide governmental collaboration to coverup a more-sinister deed unbeknown to the world's citizenry?

    If any of the factors above are true, could it be that earth's air, water and/or the food supplies have been contaminated? The only way to explain this should be seen as God's doings or man's experimentation upon humanity, gone wrong?

    CD Users, come out of your shell and be heard on this matter. Is this situation (coronavirus-worldwide) to be explained or it's to be endured? How long, Oh, Lord? CM

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    Welcome to the panic and hysterics ....

    Have a look at alternative media and critical voices. Ever heard about the saying that there are TWO sides (if not more) to a coin (matter) ??

    How about starting by recognizing that (a) the actual medical dangers of the virus, and (b) the dangers caused by the governmental steps taken are NOT to be confused. In Germany, the number of virus infected and actually virus caused (directly linked) death are not more but lower than the number infected and other influenza types virus caused death ... the figures provide the evidence. In other words, the medical situation is not really worse than it is in other years ...

    The political measures are in no sound an commensurate relation to the situation. Government has issued a lock down on a law which provides measures for quarantine of those either sick or having been in direct contact with a contagious person, it does NOT provide a legal basis for putting the healthy under lock down or house arrest or quarantine. But with proper government hysterics and mass brainwashing media propaganda, a vast majority of the public is all of a sudden in fear and almost asks "to be put in prison for their safety" ....

    The measures published and about to be taken by the government in Germany are all in line and are what could be expected in times of a finance crash and depression ..... someone looking at the situation may well get the impression that government has welcomed some "new virus" message as welcome catalyst to try and counter the finance and economy catastrophe that has been looming for a while already due to globalism ...

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

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    Is this real or hysteria? CM


    SOURCE:

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    Is this real or hysteria? CM

    A mainstream media hysteria employed in brainwashing the public ... counting on it being spread out of fear or ignorance by other media means to an even wider audience than the swindling NYT subscribed readers.

    When there are more death of suicide due to severe depression caused by the economy melt down instigated by high finance bought politicians' , perhaps the general public will wake up ?? (questionable). I currently doubt that the President will be able to stop the devastating "lock down" stuff and allow the American people ("the free and the brave") to get back to work ...

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    Brethren,

    I am not hearing any news from Russia on the Coronavirus about cases and number of deaths. If the virus doesn't survive in heat Russia should have exponentially high number of cases and death. Isn't this strange? Is the Coronavirus some kind of "germ warfare"? I am not willing to buy into any theory to help explain what's going on, but something is not right. Spiritually, Coronavirus can be blamed on the devil. Humanly, speaking, Coronavirus is a contamination of the air ("chemtrails"*), food chain, the water, out of control experimentation or germ warfare. This is the only way to explain the widespread of this virus so far, so fast-- globally. If none of the above, someone or people group need to get an Oscar for global hysteria.

    World governments don't cooperate this closely on any matters of deep importance. The UN seems to have more potentials than substance. I do know one thing, when you put together "power", "surveillance", "restriction of people's civil liberties", "money", "health and deaths", they are subject to form a salad bowl of governmental strange-bed fellows. What say ye? CM


    Source:

    https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-are-chemtrails-made-of/

    • *Chemtrails, short for chemical trails, are what some call the white trails you see left behind as a plane passes overhead. Believers in the chemical aspect of chemtrails say those trails are actually clouds of chemicals used by the government or someother large scale entity for a variety of nefarious purposes from weather modification, to human population control via sterilization, to even mind control. The theories usually claim that normal jet plane output should dissipate quickly so any clouds that do not disappear immediately must be full of additional, undisclosed substances. Chemtrail theories are not only a U.S.-based phenomena—almost 17% of respondents in an international survey noted a belief in the existence of a "secret large scale atmospheric program" to be at least partly true.
  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    Coronavirus is a contamination of the air ("chemtrails"*), food chain, the water, out of control experimentation or germ warfare. This is the only way to explain the widespread of this virus so far, so fast-- globally.

    Just for starters, none of the virologists, medical professionals over here whom I have heard in Interviews said anything about the virus spreading via contamination of the air .... any kind of virus is a virus and spreads via the same avenues ... contamination happens via more or less direct contact and enters in these cases possibly through mouth and nose. One could have virus on one's hand, picked up from a surface someone else with the virus touced and left there, etc.. and NOT be infected, If one did not touch one's face (mouth, nose area) with the contaminated hand ... thus careful washing of the hands is a rather important measure to keep from being infected.

  • Bill_ColeyBill_Coley Posts: 1,949

    @C_M_ posted:

    Source:

    https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-are-chemtrails-made-of/

    *, short for chemical trails, are what some call the white trails you see left behind as a plane passes overhead. Believers in the chemical aspect of chemtrails say those trails are actually clouds of chemicals used by the government or someother large scale entity for a variety of nefarious purposes from . The theories usually claim that normal jet plane output should dissipate quickly so any clouds that do not disappear immediately must be full of additional, undisclosed substances. Chemtrail theories are not only a U.S.-based phenomena—almost  noted a belief in the existence of a "secret large scale atmospheric program" to be at least partly true.


    I'm violating my self-imposed ban on responding to you in conventional CD exchange, CM, to point out to you what I hope you already know: About those theories that allege chemtrails "are actually clouds of chemicals used by the government or some other large scale entity for a variety of nefarious purposes," the very Scientific American article from which you quoted and to which you linked reports the following:

    "To address this concern, a group of 77 scientists published a report in the journal of Environmental Research Letters after digging through the supposed evidence of the intent to poison us through chemtrails. These scientists are experts in atmospheric science, including the contributions of aircraft to the atmosphere as well as atmospheric processes like how quickly or uniformly chemicals fall through the air to the ground. Of those 77 scientists, 76 said they found no evidence of a "secret large-scale atmospheric program"—that’s 98.7%. Instead, they found that "the data cited as evidence [for such a program] could be explained through other factors, including well-understood physics and chemistry associated with aircraft." In other words, the evidence pointed to the trails being simply the normally expected result of planes flying through the air.

    "As for that one scientist? One scientist noted that in one remote location, the levels of barium in the atmosphere were unusually high relative to the levels of barium in the soil. No claims were made that the reason for those elevated levels had to be a large scale chemical operation, but since that scientist was not convinced of a clear reason for the barium to be higher in the atmosphere there, they left the possibility open."


    Conspiracy theories, almost by definition, are baseless assertions of fact. The very article to which you linked says there is NO basis to claim chemtrails are anything other than a natural byproduct of jet airplanes.

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    Conspiracy theories, almost by definition, are baseless assertions of fact.

    Indeed, but only IF such theories are really baseless assertions of fact. However, there do exist real conspiracies and at times investigative people notice that the supposed "facts" appear suspicious and perhaps even fake. What happens next is that the real conspirators propagate the story that these investigative folks are just "ignorant conspiracy theorists" that should not be believed ... a convenient further cover of their secrecy dealings.

    Somewhere I read that the term "conspiracy theory / conspiracy theorist" was first introduced by the CIA In the 1960ies when some folks began publicly questioning the discrepancies and inconsistencies of the official report concerning the Kennedy assassination.

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541
    edited March 27

    Bill,

    Thanks for addressing me directly. My question, do you believe what the government says to its people, especially the U. S. Government, under its current leader? No scientists would speak the truth, in any way, that would expose their experiment and hinder their research and funding. U. S. History show experimentation on people group without their permission lied for years with coverups and grudgingly compensating when exposed (Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment, nuclear tests (Bikini Atolls*), Agent Orange, nerve gas on soldiers -- pill prevention, most recently, lead-poisoned water, Flint, Mich. etc.).

    Bill said:

    Of those 77 scientists, 76 said they found no evidence of a "secret large-scale atmospheric program"—that's 98.7%. Instead, they found that "the data cited as evidence [for such a program] could be explained through other factors, including well-understood physics and chemistry associated with aircraft."

    Why would anyone in their right mind believe them? The U. S. lied about the death of soldiers dying, daily, during the Vietnam War. They even lied about going to Iraqi/ Afghanistan and winning the wars. Are you fully satisfied with the U. S. explanations for JFK, MLK, RFK, the bombing of Pearl Harbor, and the World Trade Center Buildings "collapse"? Even this Coronavirus outbreak was known long before the last few weeks. They knew far back as January of 2020, given that the U. S. was not the country of origin. Denial and disinformation are why the U. S. now has the highest number of cases in the world. I am not a fan of conspiracy theories, but America's proclivity to lying to its people over vast period of time makes me less inclined to believe the so-called majority ("98.7%) of those 77 scientists, who claimed they found no evidence of a "secret large-scale atmospheric program'" through Chemtrails"Lies, lies, and damn lies."

    Bill said:

    "Of those 77 scientists, 76 said they found no evidence of a "secret large-scale atmospheric program"—that's 98.7% ... As for that one scientist? One scientist noted that in one remote location, the levels of barium in the atmosphere were unusually high relative to the levels of barium in the soil..."

    This reminds me that the majority is not always right or honestThis is true is in the OT with the 12 spies. When the spies return, they report that the land was outstanding, but most of them doubt whether the Israelites would be able to take it by force (Num 13:25–29). Joshua and Caleb (from the tribe of Judah) are the only spies to urge the people to proceed with the conquest and take the land that Yahweh had promised them (Num 13:30; 14:5–10).

    The spies who incited the people to grumble against Yahweh receive more immediate punishment—all die in a plague (Num 14:37). The spies initially delivered a report that the land was pleasant, describing it as flowing with milk and honey and presenting evidence of its fruit (Num 13:27). However, their story turned terrible as they described the people of Canaan as giants living in impenetrable cities (Num 13:28–29). Seeing that the other spies' report had stirred up fear among the Israelites (Num 13:27–29, 31–33), Caleb attempted to counter their claims by declaring, "Let us go up at once and occupy it, for we are well able to overcome it" (Num 13:30 ESV). Nevertheless, the other spies continued to deliver a bad report of the land, causing the people to view the area and God's promises as bad, and to consider a return to Egypt (Num 14:1–9).

     *The Pacific Proving Grounds was the name given by the United States government to several sites in the Marshall Islands and a few other locations in the Pacific Ocean at which it conducted nuclear testing between 1946 and 1962. The U.S. tested a nuclear weapon (codenamed Able) on June 30, 1946.


    *Some of the Marshall Islands in the Pacific Ocean — such as the and Enewetak — are more than Chernobyl and Fukushima, even though more than 60 years have passed since the United States tested weapons on those islands, a new study finds.

    Bill, stop trying to defend a country that lied from its origin (religious freedom and to native-Americans) to the present-day pandemic. CM

    Sources:

  • Bill_ColeyBill_Coley Posts: 1,949

    @C_M_ posted:

    My question, do you believe what the government says to its people, especially the U. S. Government, under its current leader? No scientists would speak the truth, in any way, that would expose their experiment and hinder their research and funding. U. S. History show experimentation on people group without their permission lied for years with coverups and grudgingly compensating when exposed (Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment, nuclear tests (Bikini Atolls*), Agent Orange, nerve gas on soldiers -- pill prevention, most recently, lead-poisoned water, Flint, Mich. etc.).

    • The study quoted in the article to which YOU linked was NOT a government study. Its authors were standard issue, run-of-the-mill professional scientists who, according to the article, were "experts in atmospheric science, including the contributions of aircraft to the atmosphere as well as atmospheric processes like how quickly or uniformly chemicals fall through the air to the ground." The appropriate question, therefore, is NOT do I believe "what the government says to its people, especially the U.S. government under its current leader." Rather, the appropriate question is do I believe what 76 of 77 NON-governmental professional scientists who were "experts in atmospheric science, including the contributions of aircraft to the atmosphere as well as atmospheric processes like how quickly or uniformly chemicals fall through the air to the ground" concluded about the exhaust from jet airplanes. I do, and see no rational, defensible reason not to, your un-sourced and not-obviously relevant assertions about "poisoned water," "pill prevention," et al notwithstanding.
    • The article to which you linked was published in September 2018, sixteen months before the first reported Coronavirus case. The most commonly offered incubation time of the virus from exposure to symptoms is no more than 14 days.


    Why would anyone in their right mind believe them? The U. S. lied about the death of soldiers dying, daily, during the Vietnam War. They even lied about going to Iraqi/ Afghanistan and winning the wars. Are you fully satisfied with the U. S. explanations for JFK, MLK, RFK, the bombing of Pearl Harbor, and the World Trade Center Buildings "collapse"? Even this Coronavirus outbreak was known long before the last few weeks. They knew far back as January of 2020, given that the U. S. was not the country of origin. Denial and disinformation are why the U. S. now has the highest number of cases in the world. I am not a fan of conspiracy theories, but America's proclivity to lying to its people over vast period of time makes me less inclined to believe the so-called majority ("98.7%) of those 77 scientists, who claimed they found no evidence of a "secret large-scale atmospheric program'" through Chemtrails"Lies, lies, and damn lies."

    • People in their "right" minds would believe the authors of the study because they are professional scientists who are expert in fields germane to the issue of so-called "chemtrails."
    • The rest of your paragraph is based on your concerns about the actions and credibility of government entities and personnel, and therefore not relevant to the article to which you linked, which, as I noted above, quoted scientists whose study was NOT connected with government entities or personnel.


    Bill, stop trying to defend a country that lied from its origin (religious freedom and to native-Americans) to the present-day pandemic.

    NOTHING in my previous post had ANYTHING to do with a defense of "a country that lied from its orgin... to the present-day pandemic." It had solely to do with the contents of the article to which YOU linked, an article which quoted the results of a NON-governmental study of so-called "chemtrails" by 77 professional scientists whom the article described as "experts in atmospheric science, including the contributions of aircraft to the atmosphere as well as atmospheric processes like how quickly or uniformly chemicals fall through the air to the ground."

  • WolfgangWolfgang Posts: 2,413

    People in their "right" minds would believe the authors of the study because they are professional scientists who are expert in fields germane to the issue of so-called "chemtrails."

    I suppose you would think the same about experts in fields germane to an issue in any field (not just "chemtrails"), but - for example - the current big topic of "Corona (CoVid-19)" as well ?

    The problem here in Germany is that there are some experts (a certain Pro. Dorsten, and experts from the government directed Robert-Koch-Institute) who are basically the only ones to whom the government listens and whose opinion on what all catastrophic might happen is propagated as "fact" and used as grounds for shutting down the economy, lock down of the general healthy (!!!) population. And then there are equally qualified (from a practical point perhaps more qualified?) medical experts who have shown how manipulative official figures of infected and dead are utilized to only cause hysteria, fear and panic. Even from official statistics normally used by governmental offices, it is evident that the current number of dead in Europe are NOT above the annual average for these times of year.

    Thus, what these government experts and government propagates appears to serve a different purpose that has nothing whatever to do with "protecting people from a virus". Any experts in the field not agreeing with the officially published view (by mainstream media) is now branded as a "fake news" conspiracy theorist.

    Now, as for the people "in their right mind" .... are those the ones following the official government line who applaud and even ask to be more restricted in order to supposedly save more people from possibly becoming a virus victim and who apparently do not are about millions of people losing their jobs and smaller companies going bancrupt? or are those the ones who evaluate the different experts' views and consider the facts that the current virus wave is in reality no deadlier or more dangerous than other virus waves in years past when more people died because of complications directly related to the virus wave??

  • C McC Mc Posts: 3,541

    Bill,

    Thanks again for your response. Your points on "Chemtrails" (one of several possible reasons for the pace and widespread of the Coronavirus) linking to the U. S Government. If what you cite is accurate, I accept without argument.

    However, I would like you to see my, overall, main points of the Coronavirus and the U. S Government minus the "Chemtrails" reference, you seem to, conveniently, cherry-picked from among many items of possible causation for the Coronavirus rapid spread worldwide.


    Bill, see below my main points minus "Chemtrails":

    Brethren,

    I do not hear any news from Russia on the Coronavirus about cases and the number of deaths. If the virus doesn't survive in heat, Russia should have an exponentially high number of cases and mortality. Isn't this strange? Is the Coronavirus some "germ warfare"? I am not willing to buy into any theory to help explain what's going on, but something is not right. Spiritually, Coronavirus can be blamed on the devil. Humanly, speaking, Coronavirus is a contamination of the air (unknown sources)food chain, the water, out of control experimentation, or germ warfare. This is the only way to explain the widespread of this virus so far, so fast-- globally. If none of the above, someone or people group needs to get an Oscar for global hysteria.

    World governments don't cooperate this closely on any matters of grave importance. The UN seems to have more potentials than substance. I do know one thing when you put together "power," "surveillance," "restriction of people's civil liberties," "money," "health and deaths," they are subject to form a salad bowl of governmental strange-bed fellows. What say ye? CM

    To keep in-focus the main points, again, Bill:

    Do you believe what the government says to its people, especially the U. S. Government, under its current leader? No scientists would speak the truth, in any way, that would expose their experiment and hinder their research and funding. U. S. History revealed experimentation on people group without their permission. They lied for years with coverups and grudgingly compensated when exposed (Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment, nuclear tests (Bikini Atolls*), Agent Orange, nerve gas on soldiers -- pill prevention, most recently, lead-poisoned water, Flint, Mich. etc.).

    Bill, 

    The U. S. lied about the death of soldiers dying, daily, during the Vietnam War. They even lied about going to Iraqi/ Afghanistan and winning the wars. Are you fully satisfied with the U. S. explanations for JFK, MLK, RFK, the bombing of Pearl Harbor, and the World Trade Center Buildings "collapse"? Even this Coronavirus outbreak was known long before the last few weeks. They knew far back as January of 2020, given that the U. S. was not the country of origin. Denial and disinformation are why the U. S. now has the highest number of cases in the world. I am not a fan of conspiracy theories, but America's proclivity to lying to its people over a vast period makes me less anything she said the Coronavirus, etc. "Lies, lies, and damn lies."

    Do you believe the President when he says, the majority of the people want to go back to work before the country gets a handle on the U. S. deaths and the spread of the Coronavirus?

    Bill, do you defend America, a country that lied from its origin (religious freedom and to native-Americans) to the present-day pandemic? CM


    Sources:

     *The Pacific Proving Grounds was the name given by the United States government to several sites in the Marshall Islands and a few other locations in the Pacific Ocean at which it conducted nuclear testing between 1946 and 1962. The U.S. tested a nuclear weapon (codenamed Able) on June 30, 1946.


    *Some of the Marshall Islands in the Pacific Ocean — such as the and Enewetak — are more than Chernobyl and Fukushima, even though more than 60 years have passed since the United States tested weapons on those islands, a new study finds.


  • reformedreformed Posts: 2,777

    Someone please bring @C Mc to reality....

  • Bill_ColeyBill_Coley Posts: 1,949

    @C Mc posted

    Thanks again for your response. Your points on "Chemtrails" (one of several possible reasons for the pace and widespread of the Coronavirus) linking to the U. S Government. If what you cite is accurate, I accept without argument.

    The point of my first response to you was that according to the very Scientific American article to which YOU linked, "chemtrails" are NOT "one of several possible reasons for the pace and widespread of the Coronavirus." Yet you chose to use the article in such a way as to suggest they were. You chose to quote from the article's first paragraph, which summarized the conspiracy (aka, baseless) theories, but then chose NOT to quote the article's central conclusion, found in its very next paragraph, that chemtrails are nothing more than natural byproducts of jet aircraft in flight.


    However, I would like you to see my, overall, main points of the Coronavirus and the U. S Government minus the "Chemtrails" reference, you seem to, conveniently, cherry-picked from among many items of possible causation for the Coronavirus rapid spread worldwide.

    I "cherry picked" your use of the Scientific American article because, as I noted above, that use so clearly misrepresented the content of the piece. To me, that's a facts thing, and facts matter.

    The remainder of your post that contained the chemtrails misrepresentation identified these topics in which I have no or very limited interest:

    • Is the Coronavirus some kind of "germ warfare"?  [There is no evidence of this.]
    • Spiritually, Coronavirus can be blamed on the devil.  [Your personal theology.]
    • Humanly, speaking, Coronavirus is a contamination of the air ("chemtrails"*), food chain, the water, out of control experimentation or germ warfare. This is the only way to explain the widespread of this virus so far, so fast-- globally. If none of the above, someone or people group need to get an Oscar for global hysteria. [Your conclusions/speculations/etc]
    • World governments don't cooperate this closely on any matters of deep importance. [Pandemics are EXACTLY the kind of issues on which I'd expect world governments to cooperate this closely.]
    • The UN seems to have more potentials than substance. I do know one thing, when you put together "power", "surveillance", "restriction of people's civil liberties", "money", "health and deaths", they are subject to form a salad bowl of governmental strange-bed fellows. What say ye? [More of your opinions/observations/speculations.]


    I want governments at every level and from every nation to work cooperatively to care for patients, improve testing, limit the spread of the virus, and find effective vaccines and treatments for it. I simply don't share your concerns for "governmental strange bed fellows," "out of control experimentation," germ warfare, or how Russian weather should affect the incidence and spread of the virus in that nation. Hence, I did not and will not comment on them. I DO have a concern for facts, which explains my decision to comment on your use of the Scientific American article.

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