Ravi Zacharias Vs R.C Sproul On Free Will (A podcast)

Mitchell

Dave_L

Thanks, really interesting. I think RC gave the classic Reformed view. And Ravi gave one of the secular positions. I think we can learn much from science when we place it in subjection to the scriptures. One of my favorite Scientists on Determinism is Einstein. He says:

"I do not believe in free will. Schopenhauer's words: 'Man can do what he wants, but he cannot will what he wills,' accompany me in all situations throughout my life and reconcile me with the actions of others, even if they are rather painful to me. This awareness of the lack of free will keeps me from taking myself and my fellow men too seriously as acting and deciding individuals, and from losing my temper."

When subjecting this to scripture: 'Man can do what he wants, but he cannot will what he wills,' I understand this as saying people cannot will the cause that preceded their choice. Their will can only react.

Another way I understand this according to scripture is: We can will according to our nature but we cannot will our nature.

GaoLu

I hear Sproul, whom I respect deeply, struggling with the specific word "free will," attempting awkwardly to use a convoluted process of other ideas and terms to allow its obvious necessity. I know he means well, but sometimes dogmatic doctrine takes us such unfortunate places.

Dave_L

@GaoLu said:
I hear Sproul, whom I respect deeply, struggling with the specific word "free will," attempting awkwardly to use a convoluted process of other ideas and terms to allow its obvious necessity. I know he means well, but sometimes dogmatic doctrine takes us such unfortunate places.

I agree. One of the biggest problems I have with contemporary Reformed Theology is the contradictions they build into their own systems to trip over.

While I've profited from many of them, I've found just a simple reading of the Word gives better understanding. If people are as sinful as the bible says, and the truth makes us free, we are not free until we know the truth and our sins that bind us are dealt with.

Consequently, only the born-again can know the truth and repent from what they were into their new life in Christ.