How To Deal with "Jehovah Witness" False Teaching: Tips and Tools
Dealing with JW's is challenging because JW's are deeply indoctrinated by the Watchtower, hold deeply-felt fear of their internal culture, and generally won't engage refutations of their teaching or false prophecies by their church leaders.
Having tools ready at hand to discern good from evil may be helpful. This thread could be a resource for doing so.
This thread could a be a locus to expose critical false teaching of the JW cult.
- Falsehood and how to kindly respond
2. Understanding the JW distortion of who Jesus is.
3. Warnings of eternal-life-threatening untruth taught by JW's and their Watchtower.
JW's do not accept Jesus as their savior:
The watchtower says Jesus is mediator for just the 144,000 anointed.
"So in this strict Biblical sense Jesus is the "mediator" only for anointed Christians." Watchtower 1979 Apr 1 p.31
"Likewise, the Greater Moses, Jesus Christ, is not the Mediator between Jehovah God and all mankind. He is the Mediator between his heavenly Father, Jehovah God, and the nation of spiritual Israel, which is limited to only 144,000 members." Worldwide Security Under the "Prince of Peace" (1986) pp.10-11
The Bible states that Jesus is our mediator, and his ransom is for all.
"… one mediator between God and men, the man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all." 1 Timothy 2:5,6
This is enough to prime the pump.
Comments
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Support Group for those escaping abuse of the JW Cult.
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More support groups for those escaping the JW cult and find the True Jehovah and salvation through Jesus.
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Testimonies of ex-JW's
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More books that may help many escape the clutches of JW's.
Shunned: How I Lost my Religion and Found Myself
I'm Perfect, You're Doomed: Tales from a Jehovah's Witness Upbringing
Leaving the Witness: Exiting a Religion and Finding a Life
We all long for the day when @BroRando is set free.
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Faithlife Corporation has more resources to consider at Logos.com (Year published for $$$)
The Four Major Cults: Christian Science, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormonism, Seventh-day Adventism (1963 for $33.99 USD)
How to Answer a Jehovah's Witness (1980 for $5.99 USD)
What’s with the Dudes at the Door? (1998 for $7.99 USD)
Author David A. Reed (journey from agnosticism to zealous Jehovah's Witness and finally to Bible-believing Christian)
How to Rescue Your Loved One from the Watch Tower (1989 for $9.99 USD)
Index of Watchtower Errors (1997 for $13.99 USD)
Jehovah's Witnesses Answered Verse by Verse (1986 for $13.99 USD)
Answering Jehovah's Witnesses Subject by Subject (1997 for $17.99 USD)
Jehovah's Witness Literature (1993 for $9.99 USD)
Faithlife ebooks about Jehovah's Witnesses
30 Years a Watchtower Slave: The Confessions of a Converted Jehovah's Witness (2002 for $9.60 USD)
An Open Letter to a Jehovah's Witness (2012 for $0.99 USD)
Conversations with Jehovah’s Witnesses: A Friendly Approach to Sharing the Truth About God and the Bible (2014 for $8.44 USD)
Fast Facts on Jehovah’s Witnesses (2012 for $3.74 USD)
Investigating Jehovah's Witnesses: Why 1914 Is Important to Jehovah?s Witnesses (2017 for $5.96 USD)
Reasoning from the Scriptures with the Jehovah's Witnesses (2009 for $10.19 USD)
REVIEWING 2013 New World Translation of Jehovah's Witnesses: Examining the History of the Watchtower Translation and the Latest Revision (2018 for $5.96 USD)
The Facts on Jehovah’s Witnesses (2008 for $4.49 USD)
The 10 Most Important Things You Can Say to a Jehovah's Witness (2001 for $7.79 USD)
What Do Jehovah’s Witnesses Believe? Answers Christians Need to Know (2011 for $2.24 USD)
Jehovah's Witnesses (2016 for $5.49 USD)
More general ebooks about Jehovah's Witnesses
Historical Dictionary of Jehovah's Witnesses (2019 for $90.00 USD)
The A to Z of Jehovah's Witnesses (2009 for $46.50 USD)
The Jehovah's Witnesses and the Nazis: Persecution, Deportation, and Murder, 1933-1945 (2001 for $26.50)
Blood Crimes: The Pennsylvania Skinhead Murders (2015 for $7.99 USD)
FYI: Logos 9 Basic & Verbum 9 Basic are free (includes license to use Reverse Interlinear for LEB & KJV 1900). Lexham English Bible is in the free Lexham Intro Collection (5 vols). Faithlife Corporation offers resource licenses for individuals, which can be used on any electronic device for that individual: desktop (Windows & macOS), smart phone (iOS & Android), web browser. My favorite desktop feature is visual filter highlighting.
Keep Smiling 😊
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Thanks! Those appear to be good, and the prices are not bad.
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A recent post of @C Mc mentioned in passing a book by the late Raymond Franz a past member of the Governing Body who also participated on the initial NWT translation team. Franz and the Watch Tower Society parted ways in 1980.
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Thanks again @Pages for bringing this to the fore of our attention. Please see my finding of the NWT Translators from the aforementioned source [https://christiandiscourse.net/discussion/979/the-new-world-translation-a-trust-worthy-bible#latest]. CM
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Interesting and helpful testimonies of JW’s.
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Another great resource.
Schnell, William J. Into the Light of Christianity: The Basic Doctrines of the Jehovah’s Witnesses in the Light of Scripture. Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Book House, 1959.
https://www.logos.com/product/41688/into-the-light-of-christianity
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The LEB removed Christ from scripture (Mark1:34) The Anti-Christian scripture rejects Christ by removing
Christ.And he healed many ⌊who were sick⌋ with various diseases and expelled many demons. And he did not permit the demons to speak, because they knew him.
to be Christ. (Mark 1:34 LEB) Christ was struck out..
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Koine Greek language does not use parenthesis () for punctuation. What is the meaning of parenthesis for (Χριστὸν εἶναι) in your Mark 1:34 screen shot image ?
How many Bible translations on Bible Hub do not have "to be Christ" in Mark 1:34 ?
Searching Westcott Hort for <Lemma = lbs/el/Χριστός> finds 8 results in 8 verses within Mark: seven of them not having parenthetical marking. Searching Westcott Hort for <Lemma = lbs/el/Ἰησοῦς> finds 81 results in 79 verses within Mark.
Why does the name of Jesus appear in the Gospel of Mark an order of magnitude more than the title of Christ ?
FYI: Mark 1:34 in LEB has footnote following ⌊who were sick⌋ => Literally “who were having badly”
Harris, W. H., III, Ritzema, E., Brannan, R., Mangum, D., Dunham, J., Reimer, J. A., & Wierenga, M., eds. (2012). The Lexham English Bible. Lexham Press.
Keep Smiling 😊
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Only the New World Translation has Christ. When we check the cross references like Luke did include Christ.
Demons also came out of many, crying out and saying: “You are the Son of God.” But rebuking them, he would not permit them to speak, for they knew him to be the Christ." (Luke 4:41)
According to Scripture the demons crried out “You are the Son of God.” They never cried out You are God. But notive Kesus rebuke is for what reason?? But rebuking them, he would not permit them to speak, for they knew him to be the Christ.
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@BroRando posted:
Only the New World Translation has Christ. When we check the cross references like Luke did include Christ.
Demons also came out of many, crying out and saying: “You are the Son of God.” But rebuking them, he would not permit them to speak, for they knew him to be the Christ." (Luke 4:41)
According to Scripture the demons crried out “You are the Son of God.” They never cried out You are God. But notive Kesus rebuke is for what reason?? But rebuking them, he would not permit them to speak, for they knew him to be the Christ.
According to the search I forum conducted, you've now referred to what you believe is a telling translation error in Mark 1.34 in more than a dozen different posts (I don't have the patience to link to them all).
Can you offer any guidance as to how many more appearances that alleged error will make in your posts before you'll decide that it's served the purpose(s) for which you first introduced it? FWIW, I no longer mined any new value from from your assertion of the mistake after its second appearance in your posts.
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Yes, but the trintrintarins won't post the Bible that has Christ in Matthew 1:34 and so the evidences ahould widelt known. Remeber, it was the universal church burn peopel at a starous from reading or wanting to translate it. Do you have of any other Bibles that has put "Christ" back in other than the NWT?
Let me know. Thanks.
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@Bill_Coley Perhaps we could say (as you have tuaght us to do) that @BroRando's posts (not his person) are a horn honking endlessly in the parking lot. The posts accomplish nothing but annoy everyone--which may be the purpose.
@BroRando Here is a site where you can get help understanding the Watchtower: http://towerwatch.com/
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@BroRando posted:
Yes, but the trintrintarins won't post the Bible that has Christ in Matthew 1:34 and so the evidences ahould widelt known. Remeber, it was the universal church burn peopel at a starous from reading or wanting to translate it. Do you have of any other Bibles that has put "Christ" back in other than the NWT?
Let me know. Thanks.
In these forums, our posts are viewed by a VERY small number of people (perhaps six currently active posters, at most). For example, the "How to Be Saved" thread, one of the newer entries to the thread count, currently has welcomed four views in its first 4-1/2 hours. This thread - "How To Deal with "Jehovah Witness" False Teaching: Tips and Tools" - has can claim 72 views since it launched more than eight days ago, almost a quarter of those the result of new posts. My point is I doubt ANYTHING we post here will be "widely known."
That said, in the majority of cases, making the same claim over and over and over again does not improve the claim's credibility, believability, or merit with other posters. In my view, such is clearly the case with your critique of translators' treatment of Mark 1.34.
As to Matthew 1.34, you've made your point. In courtrooms, attorneys will object when a question posed by opposing counsel has already been "asked and answered." You risk analogous objections from the rest of us when you repeat that point multiple times.
As to the merits of your claim itself: In multiple posts - THIS ONE, THIS ONE, and THIS ONE, for instance - you've claimed that translators "removed Christ" from Scripture, and blamed the "Deceiver and AntiChist" for that result. In my view, if those translators wanted to remove Christ from the Bible, they did a HORRIBLE job.
- The word "Christ" appears 543 times in the New Living Translation
- It appears 522 times in the Lexham English Bible
- It appears 524 times in the English Standard Version
- It appears 468 times in the New Revised Standard Version
- It appears 555 times in the King James Version
They sought to "remove Christ" from Scripture, but removed just one reference to him and left 500+ references to him in? If you drop 500 marbles on the floor and then pick just one of them back up, can you legitimately claim that you have picked up the marbles? Of course not. Your claim that translators have removed Christ from Scripture is not supported by the facts.
But what about Mark 1.34? From my review of the matter, translation teams were well within reason not to include the phrase "to be Christ" in the verse. You have every right to disagree!! But the manuscript evidence, easily discovered via Google searches, presents solid support for the translators' actions. There is certainly NO evidence - NONE - to support your claims of their nefarious intentions to "remove Christ" from Scripture.
EDIT: In the first version of this post, I mistakenly followed the lead of your previous post, which referred to MATTHEW 1.34, when the verse in question as to the alleged removal of Christ is actually MARK 1.34. This revised post corrects the error.
Post edited by Bill_Coley on -
I meant (Mark 1:34) The LEB removed Christ from scripture. The Anti-Christian scripture rejects Christ by removing
Christ.And he healed many ⌊who were sick⌋ with various diseases and expelled many demons. And he did not permit the demons to speak, because they knew him.
to be Christ. (Mark 1:34 LEB) Christ was struck out..
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On speaking in tongues (and repeating posts):
"By repeating the same 5–13 syllables multiple times, especially (but not necessarily) with gradually increasing speed, volume, and intensity and working to a climax, one induces an altered state of consciousness and often auto-hysteria." --Jack Wallace MA
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So how he responds to removing Christ from scriptture? No big deal at all, he wishes we don't talk about it. I would saying removing Christ from scripture is Anti-Chrsitian.
And he healed many ⌊who were sick⌋ with various diseases and expelled many demons. And he did not permit the demons to speak, because they knew him.
to be Christ. (Mark 1:34 LEB) Christ was struck out..
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I have 22 English language Bibles in my Logos installation. NOT ONE OF THEM includes the word "Christ" in Mark 1.34. So translation team after translation team after translation team reviewed the available manuscript evidence and decided that it did not support the inclusion of "Christ" in Mark 1.34.
Those very same teams DID include the word "Christ" approximately 500 other times in the New Testament, but not in Mark 1.34. For that single exclusion - one made by EVERY translation/paraphrase team represented in my Logos installation - you call those translations "Anti-Christian"? Your judgment makes no sense. When 22 translation teams make the same decision, and one team (NWT) makes a different call, why isn't it more reasonable to question the choice of the one team rather than the 22 teams?
And on what basis is it fair and accurate to label a translation "Anti-Christian" just because it leaves out 1 of 500 possible uses of the word "Christ"? Why would an "Anti-Christian" translation leave IN 500 other instances of the word "Christ"?
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I have 22 English language Bibles in my Logos installation. NOT ONE OF THEM includes the word "Christ" in Mark 1.34. So translation team after translation team after translation team reviewed the available manuscript evidence and decided that it did not support the inclusion of "Christ" in Mark 1.34.
That's because those 22 Bible has bias against Christ. Did not support inclusion? That's odd language since Christ is in the Greek. No , rather why the deletion? Because those 22 Bible has bias against Christ.
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@BroRando posted:
That's because those 22 Bible has bias against Christ. Did not support inclusion? That's odd language since Christ is in the Greek. No , rather why the deletion? Because those 22 Bible has bias against Christ.
This explanation of the translation choice made for Mark 1.34 by those 22 English language Bibles begs the question I asked in my previous post, but you did not address: Why would translations with a "bias against Christ" exclude this one instance of the word "Christ," but LEAVE IN around 500 other instances of the word "Christ"?
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@BroRando posted:
Do you think Christ should be removed in any of the scriptures?
I don't think the word "Christ" should be removed from any text in which it belongs; nor should the word be added to any text in which it doesn't belong. Here's my test: If the best available manuscript evidence suggests that the word "Christ" belongs in a text, then the word should be in that text. If the best available manuscript evidence suggests that the word "Christ" does NOT belong in a text, then the word should not be in that text.
From the fact that all 22 of the English language Bibles in my Logos installation chose not to include the word "Christ" in their translations of Mark 1.34, I infer they concluded the best available manuscript evidence suggests that the word "Christ" does not belong in the verse. I trust their judgment and motives.
I just answered your question directly. Now please answer my question equally directly: Why would 22 English language translations with what you described as a "bias against Christ" exclude one instance of the word "Christ" (Mark 1.34), but LEAVE IN around 500 other instances of the word "Christ"?
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For the reasons stated in my previous post, yes. I'm okay with the word "Christ"'s absence in Mark 1.34 of those 22 English language Bibles.
And again I have answered your question directly. Now please answer my question equally directly: Why would 22 English language translations with what you described as a "bias against Christ" exclude one instance of the word "Christ" (Mark 1.34), but LEAVE IN around 500 other instances of the word "Christ"?
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Thank you again for your patience.
@Bill_Coley For the reasons stated in my previous post, yes. I'm okay with the word "Christ"'s absence in Mark 1.34 of those 22 English language Bibles.
The reason I'm not okay with Christ being removed from any scripture is because it is a demonic and anti-chrsitian doctrine. Just a drop of wormwood is need to kill someone spiritually. SO, if there are 1,000 scriptures and only 1 removed Christ it is still bitter poison.
Why wouldn't Jesus allow the demons to anoounce who he was?
Mark 1:34
So he cured many who were ill with various sicknesses, and he expelled many demons, but he would not let the demons speak, for they knew him to be Christ.
Luke 4:41
Demons also came out of many, crying out and saying: “You are the Son of God.” But rebuking them, he would not permit them to speak, for they knew him to be the Christ.
Today where are the demons? In false religion, they would remove Christ from scripture and if possible they would not want you to be Baptized in the Name of Jesus Christ. (Acts 2:38)
Therefore they would remove Jesus Christ if at all possible so others could not gain salvation in receiving the free gift of holy spiriit and have their sins forgiven. There's only one Baptism for that.
The Catholic Encyclopedia, II, page 263: “The baptismal formula was changed from the name of Jesus Christ to the words Father, Son, and Holy Spirit by the Catholic Church in the second century.
"And he cried out with a strong voice, saying: “She has fallen! Babylon the Great has fallen, and she has become a dwelling place of demons and a place where every unclean spirit and every unclean and hated bird lurks! (Revelation 18:2)
The plaques are coming, the ones that will wipe out ungodly mankind as the last Days come to their end. There's nothing more dangerous than someone who fasley claims to be a Christian, like Stalin, Hitler, and Putin who all bleong the the same religion that removed Jesus Christ the baptismal formula.
And I heard another voice out of heaven say: “Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues. (Revelation 18:1)
