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But according to Luke, it was the swords that made Jesus a transgressor in the eyes of those arresting him.
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NET. Bible. Here it is without my [brackets].
“He said to them, “But now, the one who has a money bag must take it, and likewise a traveler’s bag too. And the one who has no sword must sell his cloak and buy one. For I tell you…
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I normally use the Net Bible or any based on NA28.
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You cannot deny the fact Jesus rebuked Peter for using violence in self-defence. How can you love your enemy and do violence to them? Of course Peter was just as upset as any carnal minded person would be.
The Two Swords interp…
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Thanks! good point...
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Thanks.. Sorry for the compliment, but it takes more skill to write Beat & Rhyme than "free verse".
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Thanks for the clear cut examples. This helps me to understand what I'm trying to say. It appears you posted the same link twice. Which BTW is a very good article.
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Thanks for helping to keep this thread interesting. The way I understand Peter using the sword was purely defensive. Because he was not out looking for the Pharisees. They were the aggressors looking for Jesus. And Peter thought to def…
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Did you write this CM? Beat & rhyme is my favorite level of poetry and the hardest to come by.
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How do you turn the other cheek and defend yourself?
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Samuel hacked false prophets to death. That is not your calling under the NT.
Jesus rebuked Peter for using the sword and tells all of us to put it away when he told Peter to put it away.
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Agreed. But Jesus' word supersedes anything that contradicts it in the OT.
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This would make a good thread. My position, should a thread develop is that:
Abraham and believers did not need the Law. They lived according to the two great commandments of love for God and people written in their hea…
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Jesus said the Cup was the New Covenant in his Blood. He very well knew the difference.
And you cannot justify "Christian" violence, once regulated by a Law aimed at wicked unbelievers. And you cannot justify violence before th…
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Thanks for the reminder. But perhaps you misunderstand what I'm saying. We are not under the violent Old Covenant. We are under the New Covenant.
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I believe the Mennonites come the closest to understanding NT ethics of any I've come across over the years. But I find some flaws as well. I believe they are closer than the Reformed who are on the far end of the spectrum.
In …
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Thanks for the link. Here's one for you to consider too.
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How does loving enemies square with your hatred for them?
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Since the NT does not tolerate violence from Christians, you must preach a different Christ in order to stake your claim.
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No, you hold many false doctrines in your bid to cower behind violence.
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You are saying Jesus and all of the Apostles who forfeited their lives died unnecessarily because they refused to defend themselves.
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You cannot debate Jesus or the Disciples. They uniformly condemn your pro death (under justifiable conditions including the overthrow of the US government) views.
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You cannot hold your pro death views and follow Jesus. He does not make allowances. You must love him more than your own life, put away the sword, and take the cross.
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There is not one example of ANY NT figure believing the way you do when it comes to violent self-defence. We are to put away the sword and take the cross. But you say put away the cross and take the sword.
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Thanks for the input. I have not found that reference yet but will continue looking for it. Please understand Christians defended themselves legally (up to a point) and vocally in the NT but never violently.
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Thanks for the work you put into that. But it doesn't add up. If Jesus and the other NT figures believed as you do in their interpretations of the OT, you would see them taking the sword instead of the cross. And there is not one insta…
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How do you love enemies if you kill them? How do you turn the other cheek if you retaliate? How do you not resist evil if you resist it?
Where do you find ANYONE in the NT practicing what you preach? Or in the early years of th…
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You tell us violent self defense is permissible when Jesus says it is not.
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That is an easy out for any who cannot defend their position from scripture. In your case the New Testament.
There would not be any Christian martyrs if the NT taught your position.
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It is not my opinion. If you can show me how to kill and love enemies at the same time, or how to turn the other cheek without turning it, or curse those who curse me instead of blessing them, please do. I would like to be able to not …
